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	<title>Comments on: John Freshwater Update</title>
	<atom:link href="http://bluecollarscientist.com/2008/05/12/john-freshwater-update/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://bluecollarscientist.com/2008/05/12/john-freshwater-update/</link>
	<description></description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 01 Dec 2008 19:26:07 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Atheist</title>
		<link>http://bluecollarscientist.com/2008/05/12/john-freshwater-update/#comment-2212</link>
		<dc:creator>Atheist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Jun 2008 10:01:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bluecollarscientist.com/?p=412#comment-2212</guid>
		<description>One more detail: Now we know the reason only the one kid in years had any physical problem because of the marking.

The parents admitted the reason he had some pain that one night is that right after the marking he went and put (sports?) equipment on right over the marking, irritating it.

Oppose the teacher's religiosity if you will, but leave the Tesla coil out of it.

The school politics is one thing - whether or not he was insubordinate in mentioning religion, what mention if any of religion is permissible - but I instinctively dislike trumped-up charges like the Tesla coil bit. Harmless. Let's not encourage the already-strong public suspicion of scientific stuff they don't know.

And the repetition of high-frequency, high-voltage by the general press is annoying, as if those are inherently dangerous. Current is a better criterion for danger.

Stop using the coil that way? Okay. The kids can learn science without the marking, and there's nothing wrong with accommodating parental fear. Sure, be cautious, stop the marking demo. But that's it. Don't crucify the teacher for the demo, a bogus problem. Curcify him for the resl reason - he taught creationism. But let's stay honest.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One more detail: Now we know the reason only the one kid in years had any physical problem because of the marking.</p>
<p>The parents admitted the reason he had some pain that one night is that right after the marking he went and put (sports?) equipment on right over the marking, irritating it.</p>
<p>Oppose the teacher&#8217;s religiosity if you will, but leave the Tesla coil out of it.</p>
<p>The school politics is one thing - whether or not he was insubordinate in mentioning religion, what mention if any of religion is permissible - but I instinctively dislike trumped-up charges like the Tesla coil bit. Harmless. Let&#8217;s not encourage the already-strong public suspicion of scientific stuff they don&#8217;t know.</p>
<p>And the repetition of high-frequency, high-voltage by the general press is annoying, as if those are inherently dangerous. Current is a better criterion for danger.</p>
<p>Stop using the coil that way? Okay. The kids can learn science without the marking, and there&#8217;s nothing wrong with accommodating parental fear. Sure, be cautious, stop the marking demo. But that&#8217;s it. Don&#8217;t crucify the teacher for the demo, a bogus problem. Curcify him for the resl reason - he taught creationism. But let&#8217;s stay honest.</p>
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		<title>By: Atheist</title>
		<link>http://bluecollarscientist.com/2008/05/12/john-freshwater-update/#comment-2211</link>
		<dc:creator>Atheist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Jun 2008 00:26:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bluecollarscientist.com/?p=412#comment-2211</guid>
		<description>From the HR report links above, about the device:

&lt;blockquote&gt;He said that the device is high voltage, but low current.

He said that he uses the device about twice a year and has done so for 21 years. At the end of the experiment the kids are excited and ask if they can touch it. He said that he demonstrates it on his own arm by making an “X” and then lets them touch it voluntarily. He said that the incident in
question occurred in December 2007. He remembers getting from 3 to 8 volunteers, but couldn’t remember the order or all of the names.

He said that the device is owned by the school, he received verbal instructions on using it 21 years ago, and has never seen any written instructions. He said that he has not had a complaint in 21 years regarding his use of the device. The device leaves a red mark after one or two seconds of touching, but no blisters.

In the presence of Principal Bill White, one of the investigators tried the device on own arm. There is a knob to adjust the voltage of the unit. When held at full power for one or two seconds in the manner described by Mr. Freshwater, the device left a slight redness with no burns and the
redness disappeared overnight.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Nothing here about throwing it across the room. Oh, and nothing like the hysteria of other sites saying the device could cause death.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From the HR report links above, about the device:</p>
<blockquote><p>He said that the device is high voltage, but low current.</p>
<p>He said that he uses the device about twice a year and has done so for 21 years. At the end of the experiment the kids are excited and ask if they can touch it. He said that he demonstrates it on his own arm by making an “X” and then lets them touch it voluntarily. He said that the incident in<br />
question occurred in December 2007. He remembers getting from 3 to 8 volunteers, but couldn’t remember the order or all of the names.</p>
<p>He said that the device is owned by the school, he received verbal instructions on using it 21 years ago, and has never seen any written instructions. He said that he has not had a complaint in 21 years regarding his use of the device. The device leaves a red mark after one or two seconds of touching, but no blisters.</p>
<p>In the presence of Principal Bill White, one of the investigators tried the device on own arm. There is a knob to adjust the voltage of the unit. When held at full power for one or two seconds in the manner described by Mr. Freshwater, the device left a slight redness with no burns and the<br />
redness disappeared overnight.</p></blockquote>
<p>Nothing here about throwing it across the room. Oh, and nothing like the hysteria of other sites saying the device could cause death.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Atheist</title>
		<link>http://bluecollarscientist.com/2008/05/12/john-freshwater-update/#comment-2210</link>
		<dc:creator>Atheist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Jun 2008 00:21:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bluecollarscientist.com/?p=412#comment-2210</guid>
		<description>You missed a few points.

First, the device is harmless. The single kid's parents who complained did so months later, saying their kid had pain the first night. But none of the other parents had a problem. Multiple kids volunteered for fun, after Freshwater demonstrated on himself. There were no welts but a marking that went away in a few weeks, not months. Finally, Freshwater did the demo every year (both himself and kid volunteers) for a long time and nobody objected. The school had to have known about it for years as well. Lack of objection indicates consent.

What's going on is that the school board needed to find something to beef up its excuses to fire him. The reason it wanted to fire him was his being a pain in the neck because he kept mentioning creationism in the classroom - although they had no complaints in his dossier, indicating if they told him to stop, it was only verbally.

I have no religious belief but think the religious should be tolerated. The board should have negotiated with this guy (over creationsim), a 21-year teacher, rather than firing him.

Here's a document from the outside HR firm hired by the school board. I think it biased, but it's a start.

http://www.newarkadvocate.com/assets/pdf/BF111077620.PDF
http://www.dispatch.com/wwwexportcontent/sites/dispatch/local_news/stories/2008/06/19/Freshwater.pdf

The Tesla complaint is entirely bogus. Science teachers used to do that often decades ago. BFD.

The guy's being railroaded because he's a religious nutter. The board should have the honesty to say so and keep exaggerated "branding" accusations out of it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You missed a few points.</p>
<p>First, the device is harmless. The single kid&#8217;s parents who complained did so months later, saying their kid had pain the first night. But none of the other parents had a problem. Multiple kids volunteered for fun, after Freshwater demonstrated on himself. There were no welts but a marking that went away in a few weeks, not months. Finally, Freshwater did the demo every year (both himself and kid volunteers) for a long time and nobody objected. The school had to have known about it for years as well. Lack of objection indicates consent.</p>
<p>What&#8217;s going on is that the school board needed to find something to beef up its excuses to fire him. The reason it wanted to fire him was his being a pain in the neck because he kept mentioning creationism in the classroom - although they had no complaints in his dossier, indicating if they told him to stop, it was only verbally.</p>
<p>I have no religious belief but think the religious should be tolerated. The board should have negotiated with this guy (over creationsim), a 21-year teacher, rather than firing him.</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s a document from the outside HR firm hired by the school board. I think it biased, but it&#8217;s a start.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.newarkadvocate.com/assets/pdf/BF111077620.PDF" rel="nofollow">http://www.newarkadvocate.com/assets/pdf/BF111077620.PDF</a><br />
<a href="http://www.dispatch.com/wwwexportcontent/sites/dispatch/local_news/stories/2008/06/19/Freshwater.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.dispatch.com/wwwexportcontent/sites/dispatch/local_news/stories/2008/06/19/Freshwater.pdf</a></p>
<p>The Tesla complaint is entirely bogus. Science teachers used to do that often decades ago. BFD.</p>
<p>The guy&#8217;s being railroaded because he&#8217;s a religious nutter. The board should have the honesty to say so and keep exaggerated &#8220;branding&#8221; accusations out of it.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff Menter</title>
		<link>http://bluecollarscientist.com/2008/05/12/john-freshwater-update/#comment-1848</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff Menter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 May 2008 21:25:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bluecollarscientist.com/?p=412#comment-1848</guid>
		<description>LOL @ footnote 1.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>LOL @ footnote 1.</p>
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		<title>By: Andrew Cooper</title>
		<link>http://bluecollarscientist.com/2008/05/12/john-freshwater-update/#comment-1817</link>
		<dc:creator>Andrew Cooper</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 18:29:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bluecollarscientist.com/?p=412#comment-1817</guid>
		<description>As long as the issue remains the actions of the teacher, not the device.  When we remove all of the potentially dangerous devices from the school science lab it would be a rather meaningless lab.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As long as the issue remains the actions of the teacher, not the device.  When we remove all of the potentially dangerous devices from the school science lab it would be a rather meaningless lab.</p>
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		<title>By: Blake Stacey</title>
		<link>http://bluecollarscientist.com/2008/05/12/john-freshwater-update/#comment-1811</link>
		<dc:creator>Blake Stacey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 14:10:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bluecollarscientist.com/?p=412#comment-1811</guid>
		<description>I should add that &lt;a href="http://dododreams.blogspot.com/2008/05/out-and-about-intertubes.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;John Pieret&lt;/a&gt; found the story first and fortuitously mentioned it in a post which also happened to link to my site.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I should add that <a href="http://dododreams.blogspot.com/2008/05/out-and-about-intertubes.html" rel="nofollow">John Pieret</a> found the story first and fortuitously mentioned it in a post which also happened to link to my site.</p>
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		<title>By: Blake Stacey</title>
		<link>http://bluecollarscientist.com/2008/05/12/john-freshwater-update/#comment-1810</link>
		<dc:creator>Blake Stacey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 May 2008 14:03:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bluecollarscientist.com/?p=412#comment-1810</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt; [...] when I got in touch with the business end of this thing, I dang near threw it across the classroom from my reflexive reaction to the pain.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

I would like to have been in that classroom to see that happen.  The worst laboratory disaster I witnessed &#8212; I was, in part, responsible &#8212; involved fruit flies. . . .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p> [...] when I got in touch with the business end of this thing, I dang near threw it across the classroom from my reflexive reaction to the pain.</p></blockquote>
<p>I would like to have been in that classroom to see that happen.  The worst laboratory disaster I witnessed &mdash; I was, in part, responsible &mdash; involved fruit flies. . . .</p>
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